From: Daddy Rock Star Blog
In 1987 Prince released the
double album Sign O’ The Times. It covered a wide range of
musical and lyrical styles, and some music critics, historians and fans
consider the album as one of Prince’s greatest releases. Sign O’ The
Times is included on several “Best Album” lists, including the 2003 Rolling
Stone Magazine’s “500 Greatest Albums of All Time” and VH1’s 100 Greatest
Albums. The album made it to number four on the U.S. Billboard R&B
Album chart and number six on the U.S. Billboard 200 chart, with the support of
songs such as “U Got The Look,” “If I Was Your Girlfriend” and the title track,
“Sign O’
The Times,” which topped the Billboard R&B chart and made it to
number three on the pop chart. The album also contained hidden gems such
as the jazzy tune “The Ballad of Dorothy Parker” and the classic ballad
“Adore.
At the helm was Prince’s audio engineer Susan Rogers, currently
an associate professor in the Department Of Music Production & Engineering
at Boston’s esteemed Berklee College of Music. She recently took some
time to talk with Daddy Rock Star about the recording of the Prince classic.
Susan Rogers
Before
we get into Sign O’ The Times, tell me a little bit about your
background, how you got into audio engineering and how you came to work for
Prince.
Susan Rogers: I
started in 1978 when there weren't a lot of women engineers, and there still aren't, but I wanted to be in the music business, I wanted to make records. I started as a maintenance technician to get my foot in the
door. I was the person who repaired consoles and tape machines and I didn't go to school but I was self taught in electronics. I bought the books
and read them. So I began as a maintenance tech and my first job was as a
trainee for a company called Audio Industries in Hollywood. After three
years there I was a service tech for a company called MCI Console and Tape
Machines. From there I went to work for Crosby, Stills and Nash at their
studio in Hollywood as their studio maintenance tech. Prince hired me in
1983 because he needed a technician and it turns out that he didn't really
understand – and he didn't need to understand–the distinction between a maintenance
tech and a recording engineer. He figured if you knew the equipment you could
use the equipment, which is a really safe assumption, so I became his engineer
really out of convenience for him. It worked out great for me of course
because that was my first big break. I was his engineer from 1983 until
late 1987 /early 1988 when I left; that was through Sign O’ The Times and The
Black Album, so I started with Purple Rain and the last
unofficial record would have been The Black Album. From 1988 until
2000 I was an independent engineer and producer, and after 2000 I left the
music industry to earn my PhD in Cognitive Psychology. I specialize in
Music Perception and Cognition. Now I’m at Berklee, where I've been since
2008, teaching engineering and production and the audio sciences.
Q) A lot of
music critics and Prince fans often call Sign O The Times “Princes greatest
post-Purple Rain album.” How would you respond to that
statement?
SR:
Frankly I think all three–Around The World In A Day, Under The Cherry Moon,
and Sign O’ The Times–are equivalent artistically…they’re all
different. Sign O’ The Times represented the third
record after Purple Rain. As an artist, the first record you
ever make is just a point and anything after that is a direction, so follow up
records build on what came before. But the interesting thing is when you have a
massive hit record you get to start over. This is what artists do. So when you have a record that totally says you've arrived, after you arrive,
you get to start a new journey. You can think of Purple Rain as
being a singular point, the apex of where Prince was. So now that he’s
shown the depth of what he can do, that he’s hugely talented and very creative,
now he has to show the breadth of it and how far he can go stylistically.
So he did Around The World In A Day, which was heavily influenced
by rock music, and Under The Cherry Moon, which was very heavily
influenced by pop music–a new kind of pop music. It was probably his
least R&B/funk-oriented record. Other than Controversy, I
think “Sign O’ The Times” was one of his most socially conscious
records. Sign O’ The Times represented a departure for
him lyrically; he was growing and trying new things lyrically. He had
some new textures and new sounds there as well, but definitely the single “Sign
O’ The Times” was social commentary, and it was a serious social commentary
more so than, for example, “Ronnie Talk To Russia.” It was a serious
attempt at social commentary and it was timely, so he was expressing “here’s where
I’m going, everybody.”
Q) When the
album came out, I bought it and a group of friends came over and we all
listened to it. One of the songs that sparked the most conversation
was “If I Was Your Girlfriend.” I've heard that you were
instrumental in the release of that song as a single, is that true?
SR: Prince asked me what I
thought–and that’s not something that he normally did–but he was on the fence
as to whether or not it should be a single. I think the record label was
saying, “No, don’t do it,” but he wanted to so he asked me what I thought and I
offered the opinion which tipped the scales. I told him, “I think you
should do it. I've never heard a man sing from this perspective before and as a
woman I enjoy hearing that. It’s a unique message, it makes you
interesting, it’s intriguing. I would do it.” And I think it was a bad
call. (laughing) I think ultimately looking back on it, it wasn't a good choice
as a single. It’s a brilliant song but I think with Sign O’ The Times Prince
was aware–and he said this often, so I’m not reading into things–that his black
audience was drifting away from him. After Around The World In A Day and Under
The Cherry Moon, the music was less rooted in R&B and less rooted in funk
and even pop styles that Sly Stone had familiarized us with, it had less of
that, so Prince was making a conscious effort with Sign O’ The Times to
win back some of his original audience. “If I Was Your Girlfriend,”
musically and lyrically, may not have been the right choice for winning back
that audience. It wouldn't have been the right choice for winning back a
rock and roll audience or pop audience, either. Where it would have been
a good choice would have been for winning back the art fans, the music critics
and scholars and the art lovers that could recognize that this is a new
message. The risk takers musically would be the ones who would respond to
that and I didn't recognize that at the time.
Q) I remember
when that song first came out, that lyrically, the women I knew really dug it
and understood where Prince was coming from, but initially, a lot of guys I
knew didn't get it.
SR: I could see where it
might turn men off. I could see where they would say, “No guy talks like that,”
but it’s what women want to hear. And a woman would look at a man saying
that and say, “Yes, thank you for recognizing that I think differently from you
and wouldn't it be nice if just for brief periods of time we could be on the
same page and you could be my friend and not my adversary and we could think
the same way.” That’s what he’s trying to say. Kate Bush said it–Prince
was a big fan of Kate Bush–and she said it in her song with that famous line
“come on angel, come on darling, let’s exchange the experience.” It has
multiple meanings but what she’s saying is “come on let me be you for a minute
and you be me, let’s exchange this.”
Q) That’s the
song “Running Up That Hill” right?
SR: Right, he
played that record to death! He loved that record.
Q) I've also
read that Prince’s vocal on that song was accidentally distorted during the recording, how did that happen?
SR: That was a blunder.
He would record his vocals by himself in the control room. I would set him up
and then I would leave him alone and he would work entirely by himself.
It was the only way he could get the performance he needed; he needed that
privacy. But I made a mistake and I’d inadvertently set the preamp 10db
hotter than normal so it was distorted. When he was done he would call me
back into the room and have me do a rough mix or set up for something
else. So he left the room and I came back in and I’m doing a rough mix
and I realize the entire vocal performance is distorted and I thought, ‘oh no,
I bet he hasn't listened back to this in the speakers. He’s probably just
listening in the headphones…he’s gonna come back into this room and have me
killed!’ (laughing) But he didn't mind at all and of course he heard it–he’s as
sharp as they come. There's nothing that slips past him, he heard it but he didn't mind.
People
have assumed that because these records were successful that we took the same
degree and care with the technique as we did with the art and that’s completely
false. I mean, technically, sonically these records aren't great. Many,
many, many others in which care was actually put into the technique and the
craft sound better. Our records sounded alright, their form served the
function, but what was great about it and what people were buying was not the
sonic qualities. People were buying the art, the musical attributes. In
that sense, Prince didn't care; and any of those old records, if you listen to
Sly Stone or James Brown, you’ll hear distortion all over the place but it doesn't affect the music at all.
Q) Speaking of recording
techniques, when I listen to a lot of music these days, it seems really
loud. It’s not just a matter of ‘things have progressed in
technology,’ but it just seems like the music is just louder for the sake of
being loud. Maybe it’s just another sign I’m getting older (laughing). Am
I off base with that? As an engineer who’s been around for years,
what do you think?
SR: I know what you’re
saying. The technique these days involves hyper-compression where in
mastering, and sometimes even before, you squash out all the dynamics. You
level the dynamics such that there’s no change in loudness going from the verse
to the chorus and the climaxes of the song don’t get any louder than the quiet
parts of the song. The trend began in the ‘90s…it originated from
radio broadcasters who wanted program levels to be uniformly loud. They didn't want any quiet moments that might allow a listener to switch to a new station, so record makers started competing in the same way by flattening out
the dynamics so that your record would be louder than the next guy’s…and it
sounds great when you put your record on and it just comes in hotter than the
next person’s. We know, at least here in the Western world,
consumers prefer whichever audio source is louder. It can be a
fraction of a DB hotter and the consumer will say “yeah, that one sounds
better.” But what has happened, by reducing these dynamics we’re
actually changing the emotional impact, (I’m arguing this anyway) of musical
material because dynamics are what gives a song tension and release…it gives it
a payoff. To take away the dynamics, you can listen longer because there’s
nothing changing so you can listen for a longer period of time but you’ll
probably be less emotionally engaged than you would have been otherwise. Dynamics
contribute to emotion, but, that said, we are now writing and producing music
such that you don’t need a lot of dynamics. It’s changing the way
composers and producers are working. How we think of music nowadays
we think of it as being kind of uni-dynamic.
Q) Was there any
particular recording experience that really stands out on the album?
SR: The song “Sign O’ The
Times” and the song “The Cross.” “The Cross” was one of what I used to
call “Sunday songs.” Some of his deepest, most introspective and most important
songs I noticed were recorded on Sundays.
Q) I like every
song on the album. I think “Play In The Sunshine” was a cool song
even though it wasn't released as a single.
SR: That was one
of those songs that we knocked off very quickly. Prince did what most
people do. When he would conceive of an album there were core songs that
were the heart and the skeleton of the album. “Purple Rain” was a core
song on the album Purple Rain, and of course “Sign O’ The Times”
was one of the fundamental songs for that album. So when we would sequence a
record sometimes we’d take our core songs and a few other tracks and we would
sequence them together just to hear how the album was going to sound. If
there was something missing, if there needed to be a song that would transition
between two of the core or the more important songs, Prince would actually
write something specifically to serve in the sequence. So in that sense
there were the most important songs and then there were the album cuts–the
things that were almost interludes on the record. So the songs were never
intended to be singles or even have any important message. That’s what
“Play In The Sunshine” was; it was just a bridge to get us out of “Sign O’ The
Times” and into the rest of the record. “Slow Love” was another one of
those…that was an old one from the vault.
Q) Was that the case with “It’s Gonna’ Be A Beautiful Night?”
SR: I think we
considered “Beautiful Night” more important. That was recorded live
in France. We were in the south of France and Prince was playing an
outdoor event and we had a mobile truck there from Germany and that’s when we
recorded the bed track, we overdubbed it later, I think right there in the
mobile truck.
Prince commissioned
engineer Frank De Medio to custom-build a recording console for his home
studio–the same type of console that De Medio built for Sunset Sound in Los
Angeles, where Prince normally recorded when he wasn't recording at home.
Long story short, De Medio was taking much longer than anticipated to complete
the console and Prince, being extremely eager to record, finally issued an
ultimatum that De Medio deliver the console that week. The console was
delivered and installed but Rogers hadn't gotten the opportunity to test it
properly. Tested or not, Prince was ready to record and did so, even
though, as it turns out, the console wasn't working properly. However,
technical issues aside, Prince recorded the Sign O’ The Times fan
favorite, “The Ballad of Dorothy Parker”.
Daddy Rock Star: So you’ve got this recording
console that’s not working right. You eventually got it fixed but not
before Prince recorded “The Ballad Of Dorothy Parker?”
Susan
Rogers: Right. I hadn't finished testing the audio wiring or anything; in other
words I had just soldered the last connection and Prince said, “Let’s
record.” He had been asleep and had this dream about a woman and a
bathtub and a waitress and all that, he scribbled down all those lyrics very
quickly and called it “The Ballad of Dorothy Parker.” I don’t know how aware he
was of who Dorothy Parker actually was, but he knew the name, so it wasn't the
real historical Dorothy Parker; and it was inspired by Joni Mitchell, I
remember him saying that. Anyway, he came running downstairs, we put in
fresh tape and started recording. As always, he’s playing every
instrument and I’m just panicking on the inside because something doesn't sound
right–it’s really dull, there’s no high end and I can’t wait for this song to
be finished because I've got to check it out and see what’s going on. Of
course the song is coming out really well and the whole time I’m thinking, ‘I
wish he would just stop,’ (laughs) but that’s not going to happen. The
whole time he hasn't even said anything, hadn't even commented on it and I know
he hears it but he’s really happy because he likes this song. At the very
end, he gave me my final instructions and he said, “There’s something about
this console that doesn't sound like the one at Sunset Sound, it’s really
dull,” and then he goes upstairs and goes to bed. I’m thinking, ‘Hell yeah
it’s dull, there’s no high end at all!’ (laughs) So he goes
upstairs and goes to bed and then I finally had a chance to test the board and
it turns out that it was working on only half the power, and one side of the
bipolar supply had gone out, so it was just drawing half the current. But
he conceived of the song in a dream so he didn't mind that at all because it
gave it this dreamy-like quality.
Q) I've heard other artists, like Sheila E,
mention that Prince isn't as concerned with everything being technically
perfect in the studio; he’s more concerned with the music being right.
SR:
He was a perfect example of an artist who didn't need to rely on any special
kind of tool, any special conditions, any special kind of situations; he didn't believe in any voodoo or magic associated with the work. If you've got the goods you can show up at any studio with any console with any
microphone – he didn't care if he used his expensive microphone or his cheap
one, he didn't care – you can record under any circumstances if you’re the real
deal and that’s how he was. He wasn't going to let a little thing like no
high end stop him from making music.
Q) Was there anything in particular that
Prince preferred when it came to recording in regards to the studio set up?
SR: Well,
a couple of things. One he wanted everything there and set up ahead of
time because he wanted to be able to move from instrument to instrument.
Unlike most other people his ideas came extraordinarily fast; at lightening
speed compared to how most people think so by the time he was done playing one
part on one instrument he would already have in his head the second part on
another instrument. So you just had to have everything set up,
plugged in, sound on it, ready to roll because if you don’t there won’t be
time. In fact I even have a handwritten note from him at home that I
saved that says ‘the more you’ve got plugged in and ready for me to go the
faster I’m going to be able to work’ and then it says ‘save my blood pressure.’
(laughing) So that was one thing, and the other was his privacy. Unless
his band was there he had to be completely alone. We did NOT have
visitors (with rare exceptions), we did not have visitors in but I was proud.
Q) So when you recorded you mainly worked
out of two studios?
SR: We’d
either be working out of his home in Minneapolis at his home studio or Sunset
Sound. Paisley Park was being built during that time so at the tail end
of my tenure with him I did work at Paisley Park, but after it was built he
could work a whole new way. Now he could have a staff of engineers so our
time was through. So we either worked at Sunset Sound in L.A. or we
worked at his home or we worked in the warehouse. He had a warehouse
space that he leased where he left all his gear set up. That’s where his
band rehearsed and his live sound set up was there so it was either at the
warehouse, at home or at Sunset. This was all pre-Paisley Park the
studio. He needed that privacy. He needed his people around him,
the people that he knew well and that he could feel comfortable with.
During that time I was one of them. When we were at Sunset Sound, for a
while it was Peggy McReary and then Coke Johnson, they were employees of Sunset
Sound, so during that time if he was recording I was there. I knew how he
liked to work, I could be quiet, I was his facilitator of recording, I made
that happen. So whether we were on the road or it was live or working on
movies, if he was working I was there and I was proud of that. It was
hard work.
Q) As a musician I've done my fair share of
recording and definitely understand the value of the engineer. I don’t
know if people actually realize the importance of an engineer in regards to the
chemistry with an artist. It’s really important to have someone you click
with, as opposed to someone who’s just pushing buttons.
SR: That’s
true. I knew we were going to click when I had only worked with Prince
for about a week or two and he, Morris Day and Jesse Johnson were in the home
studio having a conversation about music. I was minding my own business,
but it was a small control room. So I was just being quiet, doing
whatever it was that needed to be done, keeping my mouth shut, but I think it
was Morris who mentioned a song that I loved by One Way featuring Al
Hudson. When he mentioned the song I just said ‘oh yeah!’ I couldn't help
myself, it was automatic and I said it under my breath but again, it was a
small control room. So when I said that they just stopped and looked at
me and I looked at them and it was like they all knew ‘okay, we've got the same
frame of reference don’t we?’ It wasn't a planned moment but I was glad that Prince realized ‘yeah,
your frame of reference is the same as mine. We listen to the same music
and I know what you’re talking about. I value what you value.’ I
think he was glad to have an engineer who shared his value system because
that’s important.
Q) A friend of mine told me that she didn’t become a
Prince fan until she recently heard the song “Adore” on the old school
station. I always hear that song played on old school stations.
It’s an incredible ballad and still stands the test of time. Was that one
of those “core songs” you mentioned before?
SR: “Adore” represented Prince’s conscious effort to write
for black radio in an attempt to counter criticism that he was primarily a pop
writer and that his status was diminishing as an influential R&B
artist. I know this because he said so while we were tracking it.
The organ and vocal arrangements on “Adore” are purely gospel. I am not
sure I’d say he considered it one of the most critical songs on the record
because it stands alone on Sign O’
The Times. It’s interesting how easily he could adopt the
gospel style in his arrangements but so rarely did. I think his critics
were accurate; Prince was a pop artist, and personally I think that’s high
praise. Pop in and of itself is not a style; the pop chart only reflects
the condensed versions of more pure styles (e.g., hip-hop, dance, country,
punk). Prince wrote funk and R&B and arranged these songs in a
popular style.
Q) In regards to a couple of fan favorites, “Housequake” and “U
Got The Look,” is there anything that comes to mind about those songs as far as
the concept or recording of them?
SR: “Housequake” was done at Sunset Sound during a period when
Prince was re-examining dance music. I believe his exploration of
funk at this time was considering the influences of rap and hip-hop, now
firmly established as more than just musical fads.
Q) And with “U Got The Look,” how was it recording with Sheena
Easton?
SR: “U Got The Look” was also tracked at Sunset Sound. We
spent much longer on it than usual–several days rather than the typical 24
hours it took Prince to track, overdub and mix a song. I recall that it
was tracked over the Thanksgiving weekend. We had planned to take
Thanksgiving Day off but we were in the middle of the Sign O’ The Times album and stopping momentum was not
easily done. The thing I remember most about Sheena’s visit was that when
Prince asked her if she’d like to take a minute and warm up vocally, she
replied that she was always warm vocally. For most singers this is a
hollow boast, but it was true in her case. She has an excellent voice and
did the vocal very quickly. I’m sure that Prince was aware of “U Got The
Look”’s single potential. He experimented with tempos; it started as a
slower jam. Once he bumped it up to dance tempo, much of the
instrumentation changed. The hook is really strong–perfect pop material.
Q) This album was long time in the making…
SR: Yeah, at one point it was going to be triple album called Crystal Ball and the record label argued against
his releasing a triple album so he decided to make it a double album and he re-conceptualized it. So the record was really a long time in the making
because it was more than one record. So many songs went on it and then
came off; which is why I think The Black
Album was a follow-up
because unlike some of the other records, Sign O’
The Times’ final
realization was not how it was conceived.
Q) Why do you think the Sign O’ The Times album still
resonates with music listeners and is still so relevant 25 years later?
SR: I think the relevance of Sing O’
The Times must be
rooted in the strength of the writing–lyrics, melodies, harmonies, and
rhythm. It is astonishing how well Prince’s music holds up over the
decades. Not only are the arrangements solid but the writing is pretty
invincible. Most of these titles can be stripped down to just their
melodies or just their rhythm tracks and they would be compelling and
interesting. Lesser recorded works are only viable because of novelty in
the arrangements or the cult of personality surrounding the vocalist him- or
herself. If you can imagine stripping down a lesser song to just its
melody and lyrics and then learning its chord progression, you may find that it
is pretty insubstantial without the arrangements and recording techniques that
support it. Prince understood the art of recording more than practically
anyone I can name. He understood how a record functions for the listener;
it needs to work in multiple contexts and formats. It is one thing to be
a gifted writer or performer but quite another to be a recording artist.
Q) What kind of music did you listen to growing up?
SR: When I was a kid growing up my favorite artists were Sly Stone,
Al Green and James Brown. Those were my favorites and that was the music
of my childhood, that’s what I knew and that’s what I loved.
Q) Were you familiar with Prince’s music before you began
working with him?
When I first heard Prince, I was young, I was in Los Angeles and I
became an instant fan. He was my favorite artist in the world. If
someone had asked me in early 1983, “What would be your dream, if you were to
write down on a piece of paper your fondest wish and hope?,” I would have
written down “to work for Prince.” And that actually happened…the dream
literally came true. So every single day I was in the studio, I’ll never
forget the feeling with every new song I heard, nearly every time I would have the
experience of thinking ‘this is the best song he’s done…this is my favorite
Prince song.’ I was so lucky and I cherished every moment.
